intfiction.org

The Interactive Fiction Community Forum
It is currently Sat Feb 23, 2019 4:53 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 8:32 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 7:03 pm
Posts: 577
Location: Washington
auraes wrote:
About Constant NO_SCORE:
without Constant NO_SCORE, Frotz displays Score and Moves;
with Constant NO_SCORE, Frotz displays only Moves but Windows Frotz and Gargoyle Bocfel displays nothing.
Who is right?
ReleaseNotes.html for the compiler says:
Quote:
The scoring system is completely disabled if you define a constant NO_SCORE near the start of your game.
Constant NO_SCORE;


I can't fathom how Windows Frotz and Bocfel do this because the printing of the score and move count is entirely up to the Inform6 Library. NO_SCORE was introduced by Graham back in version 6/11. I tried some other interpreters including Glulxe, Git (glulx terp), Fizmo, glkzip, nitfol, and jzip.

I'd say that Windows Frotz and Bocfel are misbehaving.

_________________
David Griffith


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 8:47 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2009 4:02 am
Posts: 2600
Could something be mis-measuring the window so that it wants to print it but doesn't think there's space?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 9:43 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2010 4:56 pm
Posts: 5921
Or it's measuring the window correctly and deliberately omitting the Moves line if the window is too narrow?


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Sep 09, 2018 10:12 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Aug 18, 2010 1:15 pm
Posts: 80
auraes wrote:
About Constant NO_SCORE:
without Constant NO_SCORE, Frotz displays Score and Moves;
with Constant NO_SCORE, Frotz displays only Moves but Windows Frotz and Gargoyle Bocfel displays nothing.
Who is right?
ReleaseNotes.html for the compiler says:
Quote:
The scoring system is completely disabled if you define a constant NO_SCORE near the start of your game.
Constant NO_SCORE;

As has been speculated, this appears to be a window width issue. At 66 columns, “Moves” disappears from the status bar in the program below (thanks to David Griffith for sending it to me). I've reproduced this both with Bocfel (Gargoyle) and Frotz (Curses). As such I suspect it to be something Inform is doing.

At the very least it probably means I should bump the default number of columns in Gargoyle up from its current value of 60.

To reproduce:
Code:
Constant NO_SCORE;
Include "parser";
Include "verblib";

Object here "Here or anywhere"
   with description "You are somewhere.",
   has light;

Object ball "ball" here
   with name 'ball';

Object rock "rock" here
   with name 'rock';

[ Initialise; location = here; ];
Include "grammar";


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 3:53 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2011 7:03 pm
Posts: 577
Location: Washington
zarf wrote:
Or it's measuring the window correctly and deliberately omitting the Moves line if the window is too narrow?


That's exactly what's happening. Here are the relevant lines from parser.h:

Code:
        if (width > 66) {
            #Ifndef NO_SCORE;
            MoveCursor(1, posa);
            print (string) SCORE__TX, sline1;
            #Endif;
            MoveCursor(1, posb);
            print (string) MOVES__TX, sline2;
        }
        #Ifndef NO_SCORE;
        if (width > 53 && width <= 66) {
            MoveCursor(1, posb);
            print sline1, "/", sline2;
        }
        #Endif;


Most of Infocom's games seem to change from "Score:" and "Moves:" to "S:" and "M:" at 54 columns or fewer, so I'll look at changing the Library to do that instead,

_________________
David Griffith


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 11:24 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 30, 2013 4:55 am
Posts: 122
Some Infocom games on apple 2e show Score: 0/0 instead of Score: 0 Moves: 0.
(Without Constant NO_SCORE: Score: 0/0; with Constant NO_SCORE: Moves: 0; it's nice.)
From which Z-machine computer (Trs-80, C64, PC, etc.) Infocom games comes the design of Inform games?


Last edited by auraes on Mon Sep 10, 2018 11:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 11:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:13 am
Posts: 2692
Location: The Midwest
I'm going to hazard a guess that those are the earlier games, like the Zorks?

_________________
Daniel Stelzer


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 11:43 pm 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 30, 2013 4:55 am
Posts: 122
Draconis wrote:
I'm going to hazard a guess that those are the earlier games, like the Zorks?
Yes, but on which computer and with which Z-machine design? There are differences in text design from one Z-machine computer to another.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Sep 10, 2018 11:52 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:13 am
Posts: 2692
Location: The Midwest
auraes wrote:
Draconis wrote:
I'm going to hazard a guess that those are the earlier games, like the Zorks?
Yes but on which computer and with which Z-machine design? There are differences in design from one Z-machine computer to another.

Sorry, I'm not quite sure I understand your question?

In early Z-machine versions (3 and earlier) the status line is handled completely by the interpreter: it displays the name of the object referenced by a certain global variable on the left, and either score/moves or hours:minutes from two globals on the right (choice of format based on a header flag). The exact formatting is up to the interpreter, so it can vary widely across systems.

In version 4 and onward, the status line is handled by the game: the interpreter just provides a system to draw whatever the game wants. Which might be a classic v3-esque status line, or just the location name centered (as in Trinity), or anything else.

So my guess is, the only games whose status lines vary across interpreters are the v3 and previous ones. And for those, it's up to the interpreter writers rather than the game writers to decide how modern terps should display them.

Apologies if this is all old information to you: just let me know if I misunderstood your question!

_________________
Daniel Stelzer


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Tue Sep 11, 2018 11:15 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Dec 30, 2013 4:55 am
Posts: 122
Thank you for your answer. The answers on this forum are always interesting, even if the question is bad and in very bad English.


Top
 Profile Send private message  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 46 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 3 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group